There’s a reason that we call getting married “tying the knot.” When two people vow to love each other forever, in front of God, their lives join together in a bond that feels unbreakable. However—like all knots—over time our marriages can get frayed and even loosen.

Healthy churches and healthy marriages are deeply and intricately connected. They both need each other. Ron and Jody Zappia have a story of a redeemed marriage. They use their story as a platform to show God’s glory and use transparency to help other couples find hope. Today on the podcast, they join Dave to talk about how churches can partner with couples to help them develop and maintain healthy marriages.

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Topic Timeline

The MarriedPeople Curriculum provides a year of resources to help your church do marriage better (1:45)

Ron and Jody share the story about how they met and their early years of marriage (3:05)

How Christian counseling met Ron and Jody at their lowest (8:25)

What a kingdom-minded view looks like in reality (12:45)

The Lord is near to the broken-hearted (17:35)

We have a responsibility to use our stories for God’s glory (20:35)

The Marriage Knot: The choices husbands and wife need to make to continuously tighten and strengthen the knot (22:00)

The major falls in marriage (24:30)

The seven Biblical choices couples can make to support their marriage (27:00)

A candid conversation about what Biblical intimacy looks like in marriage (28:05)

The most common marriage issue all couples deal with (33:00)

How to choose to love unconditionally (35:35)

The equation for forgiveness (36:45)

Dave’s lightning round of marriage questions for Ron and Jody (40:20)

What’s one piece of practical marriage advice? (40:45)

What about church leaders who have never been married? (41:20)

What’s one thing churches can do to partner with married couples? (42:25)

What’s one piece of advice for ministry leaders who are married?(44:55)

What’s one piece of advice you have your kids that you want all of us to hear? (45:05)

Dave’s final thoughts (49:20)

People, Places & Helpful Resources

Pastor Ron and Jody Zappia

The MarriedPeople Curriculum

The Marriage Knot by Ron and Jody Zappia

Ron and Jody’s Marriage Conference: TheKnot.CC

Featured Guests

Ron & Jody Zappia


Ron Zappia is the pastor and founder of Highpoint Church, a multi-site church reaching thousands in the western suburbs of Chicago. Jody Zappia leads the Women’s Ministry for Highpoint. Together, they’ve written the book The Marriage Knot.  Ron and Jody live in Wheaton, IL with their three daughters: Allie, Erin, and Emily.

Quotes from This Episode

Ideas to Influence the Next Generation

Keep a Kingdom-Minded view

When Jody first walked into the church near her house, hoping for affirmation that she should file for divorce, she was comforted and spoken to by the pastor’s wife. The pastor’s wife actually knew of a marriage program at a different church for couples who were considering divorce and sent Jody their way.

At that moment, the pastor’s wife had a kingdom-minded view. She wasn’t worried about retaining Jody as a member or getting her involved in another ministry. She simply cared about what was best for Jody and Jody’s relationship with God and her husband. The church she sent her to ultimately saved her marriage and brought Ron and Jody to Christ.

Hurting people can help hurting people

The Lord is near to the broken-hearted. He uses people who are open, honest and authentic with their story to give hope to others. Being brave with your story glorifies God and reminds others that Christ is the great healer.

Love, forgiveness, and trust

After a betrayal in a marriage, many couples worry that they’ll never trust each other again. But here’s the good news… God doesn’t ask you to trust your spouse (or yourself). He asks you to trust in Him. What He does ask is that you love each other and forgive each other. Over time, the trust will come back.

Conversation Starters For Your Church

How can our church keep a kingdom-minded approach in helping anyone who walks through our doors?

What can we do to partner with our married ministry leaders to support their marriages?

How can our church model unconditional love?

Your Hosts

Dave Adamson, The Think Orange Podcast Host


When he’s not working as a pastor at North Point Ministries in Atlanta, Dave is usually making his family cross their arms, roll their eyes, and tap their feet while he takes “just one more quick photo” on family outings. You’ll also often find him up to his neck in “Jewish stuff” as he researches the cultural context of Jesus for his daily Instagram devotions. Learn more about Dave at

Join Us Next Week

Thank you for listening to the Think Orange Podcast.

We hope you’ll join us for next week’s episode. More importantly, we hope that when you think next generation, you think Orange.